26 Aug 2021
After starting off our NFL Punterview series with young guns Jake Bailey and Jack Fox, we had the pleasure of sitting down with 13-year pro and 3-time Pro Bowler Brett Kern.
The Punt Runts: You, more than anyone else, were responsible for ending the Patriots dynasty, with your punt in the playoffs, that then led to the pick six that closed out that game. Walk us through that.
Brett Kern: Itās funny you bring that up, because I think Pro Football Focus called it the worst punt of the week, because it had no hang time, down the middle of the field. For them, itās a bad punt.
And you know, itās hard to break down punts based on the situation. In that situation, it was the end of the game, they were bringing nine guys to rush, and we only had eight guys to block. So really itās, how fast can I get it off compared to the guy thatās free. Knowing that they donāt have a returner, if I can get that ball over the line of scrimmage, I donāt want it to turn over, because if it turns over, sometimes when that nose hits, especially on turf, it could just stop.
But if I could get it to where it doesnāt quite turn over, then I know it can roll. If I could get it to roll 20-30 yards, itās going to take time off the clock. My goal was, hey, Iām normally around 2.0 [seconds from snap to punt], Iām going to step-and-a-half this thing, and try to get it off in 1.7, 1.8. I just want to get it about 30 yards and get some momentum on it, let it hit the ground, just let it roll, and see how far it goes. It rolled probably a good 20-25 yards, and then Dane Cruickshank, who was our gunner, he beat his single, went down there, and was ready to stop it there on the 1. We practiced that punt, probably once a week, because that situation doesnāt come up a bunch.
For me personally, I felt like that was one of the better executed punts I had all season. I felt like I had a really good year that year, but that one, that time, under that pressure. You couldnāt even see the upper deck, thatās how foggy it was [in New England]. To hit that punt in that situation was really important, and it was a fun one, knowing that the next play was a pick six and we won the game.
The Punt Runts: How do you approach punting? What makes a good punt?
Brett Kern: Yeah, Iām a very analytical person. I chart all my punts, spread them out in an Excel spreadsheet. If Iām on the right hash, my goal is to try to get every ball outside the numbers. I have a scale of how to do that: thereās 12 yards from the numbers to the sideline, so I give myself a 0 if itās on the numbers, and a 12 if it goes out of bounds.
I look at each spot I punt from, it could be right hash, going right, it could be left hash, going right across the field, or vice versa going left. When the yearās over with, I compute it all up and look at, āthis year I did really well going right from the right hash, but I didnāt do as well, or, as consistent as I wanted, maybe, on the left hash going right.ā So I just take all that, and then heading into the offseason, I know in which areas I need to get better, and in which areas Iām doing well.
The Punt Runts: What do you feel like your improvement has been like during your career? What kind of things are you focusing on?
Brett Kern: I started to get a bit more comfortable in 2014. My special teams coach, he said, hey, youāre really good at directional punting, but [you need to] find that go-to punt where you feel like, in any situation, you could go hit that. So I really started working on that right ball, about a 4.4 or 4.5 hang time, nice little spiral, that I really felt like I could control.
I would put a trash can out there, about 50 yards, on the sidelines, and that really became my target. Getting comfortable with the steps that I needed to take, the visual line with it. And once I felt like I had that punt in my back pocket, I really felt like I could pull it out at any time.
I really donāt want to have any thoughts when Iām going out there. I just want to go out there, pick my target, feel confident with it and let it rip. So I think at that point [around 2014] thatās kind of when I hit that mark, and obviously just keep building upon it, year by year.
Thatās probably why Iām so interested in what you guys do, because itās very analytical, and I kind of follow the same approach with looking at it that way.
The Punt Runts: One of the big things in our stats is this thing we call RERUN where we exonerate punters for long returns. So far in our talking to NFL punters weāve gotten different opinions over the extent to which a return is always the punterās fault. What are you thinking when thereās a long return?
Brett Kern: Yeah, well, that sucks. Itās a really crappy feeling, to get a long return on you. But knowing that I feel like Iām one of the best in the league at being able to put a ball out of bounds when I want to, I think it starts with me. And if I have a bad punt, or if I donāt put it close enough to the sidelines or out of bounds, thatās on me.
And so when thereās a big return, Iām jogging to the sidelines thinking hey, that oneās on me. Letās say it was a +4 punt [4 yards outside the numbers] and it was 4.5 hang time, knowing that could have been a 4.5 hang time at a +12 (out of bounds) or +11, maybe +10, to really allow that gunner to go over there and squeeze him down.
You know, sometimes Iāve had balls where Iāve hit 4.9s that were 45 yards, and by all statistical measures, that should have been a fair catch, and a guy gets 20 yards somehow. Guys are gonna miss tackles; I punt for a living, I donāt make tackles for a living, and so Iām not going to sit back there and say hey, you know what, you should have made that tackle, that oneās your fault, knowing that I probably could have hit a better punt. If it was a 4.9, 45, and it was down the middle of the field, well you know what, thatās on me, that should be towards the sidelines.
Iāll hit some balls that are 60 yards, close to the sidelines, but the hang timeās not great, and so I might put the gunner in a bad position. He might take a swipe at him, he might miss, he might slow them up. Thereās so many different situations that come up, but really at the end of the day, if I hit my best punt, for the most part, there really shouldnāt be much of a return. And so, if thereās a big return, obviously, Iām looking at myself saying, what could I have done better to not allow that return.
The Punt Runts: Whatās the variation in how generous refs are in spotting out-of-bounds punts?
Brett Kern: Ugh!
It gives me nightmares. The nightmares Iāve had, you know, especially for the guys that directional punt ā¦ Sam Koch and I have had some stories that weāve shared back and forth.
You know, Iāve had punts that have gone out of bounds, and Iāve gotten ripped off of 10 yards. I remember, gosh, this was two years ago, and we were playing at Jacksonville, it was the first punt of the game, weāre on the left hash, I was standing on the goal line. And [then Titans kicker] Ryan Succop was down there, I actually told him, if we punted from here, I want you to stand right there, because youāre gonna be my target. He said all right, so he probably stood at the opposite 30 yard line because he was right by the kicking net.
And you can go check it on film, I think it was the first part of the game and I ripped off a laser that went left, and it was probably 4.4 or 4.5 [seconds of hang time] and he moved one step and caught it right on the sidelines. I was like, perfect, this is great, this is going to be about a 55 yard punt, out of bounds, nothing. And then the official kept walking away from Ryan, and I was like no, no, no, no, no, he caught it right on the sidelines thereās no way they can be taking this much yardage off of me. He ended up giving me a 40 yard punt. I probably got ripped off about 12, 13 yards.
The Punt Runts: Oof
Brett Kern: You know you got your white chalk, your white paint [along the sideline] - if you can put it in that white paint, the refs are pretty accurate. But if you get that ball outside the paint, a lot of times, theyāre not seeing where it landed. So theyāre going based off of your angle, and itās just a complete crapshoot.
So this past year I hit one that I thought, you know, gosh, that was only maybe forty yards. The official really had no idea where it went out of bounds, and gave me like a 51 yard punt. So sometimes, you get a break, and other times, you get totally ripped off.
The Punt Runts: Tell us a little bit about fakes. Thereās the sort of famous one in the 2020 AFC championship game against the Chiefs. Is that something that is always in the back of your mind, or is it something that is really prescribed in the situation? How do you develop your fake-punt poker face?
Brett Kern: In Kansas City, it was so cold, my hands were still in my muff. Normally I might take my muff out there and Iāll put my hands in it, and then Iāll throw it to the side and get ready for the snap.
Well my hands were still in the muff, and the ball was snapped. My hands were in the muff, and I just fwip took it off, caught the ball, and ran and threw it.
So, uh, I guess I probably gave it away, knowing that the ball was snapped, and my hands were still in the muff. That was probably one of the worst ones.
The Punt Runts: Incredible.
The Punt Runts: Youāve played against pretty much every punter in the league. Whatās the punter fraternity like? Whatās it like during a game, watching a punter you know from the other sideline?
Brett Kern: I think the coolest part is that thereās not one guy in the league that looks the same. Everybodyās got their own technique, their own style. Different drop, different steps.
Rigoberto [Sanchez] in Indy - what he can do with the football is different than what I can do, but to see him succeed is awesome. Everybodyās got their own little niche. Sam Koch hits that boomerang-type punt - not a lot of hang time, but that thing is wicked to catch. A lot of returners let it go, yell āPeter Peterā and that ball rolls 20 yards. Iām thinking, oh my gosh, if he can do that, heās gonna play another 10 years. This has prolonged his career, itās unbelievable to watch.
Or you know, watching Johnny Hekker. I always loved going against [longtime Saints punter Thomas] Morstead, because weāre both directional punters. Watching how he punts the ball, compared to how I punt the ball, itās just cool. And to see a lot of these young guys come up, [Patriots punter] Jake Bailey, [Lions punter Jack] Fox. Some of these guys, the leg speed they have, the power they have, itās truly amazing to watch.
So I kind of sit back, and I feel like Iām like the Greg Maddux. Iām older, but I know what I can do, I know what my limits are, I know what Iām comfortable with.
Watching Jack Fox last year when we played Detroit, he hit a ball and I thought, oh man, thatās a mis-hit. And I look up and Iām like, oh my gosh, this is unbelievable. It was like a 5.4 hang time, like 65 yards, and Iām thinking, Iāve never been able to do that in my life. The power, the strength that he has.
[Seahawks punter] Michael Dickson - Iāve never seen somebody with such a fast leg before, somebody that can just whip through it so fast. You might look at his drop and you think, thatās not a great drop, but his leg is so fast that he can make up for really any type of error. Iām glad to see that he got paid.
I think itās just awesome to see guys across the league, and everybodyās different. How they got to the league, how theyāre succeeding in the league, is so cool to watch.
The Punt Runts: We always say, we really want NFL BlueZone that only shows punts.
Brett Kern: Yeah, I always joke around about how there really arenāt any specialists in the Hall of Fame. And I say, there needs to beā¦ you know youāve got, in Canton, the main NFL building, all that kind of stuff. And then thereās probably a hallway for the bathrooms. You go down the hallway and you can build, like, an add-on, and it can be the Special Teams Hall of Fame. If youāre curious, you go to the bathroom, and youāre like āoh whatās down this wing.ā That way you have the best punters, the best kickers and returners, and itās got its own little special wing.
And you donāt have to get a gold jacket. It could be a different color, if guys are sensitive about that. You know kickers, punters, everybody looks at us differently, and I totally understand that. Weāre not making tackles, all that kind of stuff.
You can look at the analytics of what Justin Tucker has done for Baltimore, some of the best kickers that have ever kicked, and how theyāve impacted their team. Puntingās probably a little bit harder to figure out, but Iām sure you could figure out punters, over their careers, how theyāve impacted field position, and if thatās had any implications on a game here or there.
So like I said, I think there should be a little section past the bathrooms in Canton. Small little room, it doesnāt have to be big. But just a little spot for the specialists.
The Punt Runts: Weād love that.